These last two episodes of The Rings of Power sure did some things, didn’t they? Have they changed my overall opinion of the show? Only a little, because I’m still compartmentalizing this thing. Have episodes 4 and 5 made my trust in the showrunners waver somewhat? Yes. Do I retain hope that the show will “survive” this recent stumble, and go on to still be excellent overall? Yes, I’ve still got some hope. But it’s Amdir hope, not Estel hope. I’ll explain.
So here follows another opinion-riddled discussion of the last two episodes, filled to the brim with spoilers.
So what’s Amdir? That’s a term that comes up in the Athrabeth Finrod ah Andreth (the “The Debate of Finrod and Andreth” from Morgoth’s Ring). Sometime during the First Age, during a time of relative peace, Andreth, a wise-woman of Men, is speaking to her friend Finrod—who is truly not the Rings of Power take on Finrod, but Tolkien’s truer and more righteous one. Going forward, when I slap the adjective RoPer on something, I’m referring very specifically to the Rings of Power version of that thing. For example, Gil-galad from Appendix B of The Lord of the Rings “refuses to treat with Sauron” when Sauron attempts to seduce the Elves in 1200 of the Second Age. Whereas RoPer Gil-galad has strange hair and is built like an Elf-quarterback.
Anyway, Finrod and Andreth are discussing death and the very different dooms of Elves and mortal Men. At one point, she begins to despair, and points out to him that only darkness lies ahead for mortals.
‘Have ye then no hope?’ said Finrod.
‘What is hope?’ she said. ‘An expectation of good, which though uncertain has some foundation in what is known? Then we have none.’
‘That is one thing that Men call “hope”,’ said Finrod. ‘Amdir we call it, “looking up”.
There are two varieties of hope, Finrod goes on to explain. Amdir is a kind of realistic hope rooted in precedent, expectation, or experience. It’s a reasonable hope, however slim, based on something substantial. Because The Rings of Power has had some excellent plot threads, characterizations, and themes that are both moving and complementary of Tolkien’s work, I will trust that the show will succeed in the most important ways in the days to come. Elrond’s friendship with Durin; Disa herself; Nori, Poppy, and the Stranger; Arondir and Bronwyn . . . these are characters and storylines I really enjoy even though I don’t know where they’re all going. So when the show missteps, as it has in episode 5, I maintain Amdir that it will still retain a faithful heart because it’s still got a lot going for it.
What I do not have at this time is Estel, hope that springs from something greater; hope that trusts that in the end a truly outstanding depiction of Middle-earth will prevail because it must, because a greater power lies above and will ensure that all comes to right. I think showrunners Payne and McKay have the best of intentions, but those who pay them, of course, mostly just want to profit.
So yes, I’d like to talk about the precarious corner into which the show has painted itself, and then I’ll offer some comments on other elements. But part of my Amdir, “looking up,” is thinking that all choices the writers have made have at least been deliberate. I don’t think it’s ignorance of the source material that we’re seeing in episode 5. It’s going somewhere, and we’ve still only seen five out of fifty episodes. This can’t be the whole situation with the Elves.
Anyway, let’s get to it. Starting with a quick refresher on the major plot lines…
Episode 4, “The Great Wave” — Queen Regent Míriel has a terrible dream. Then, as some of the Númenóreans are disgruntled about Galadriel and Halbrand’s shenanigans, Pharazôn gives an “impromptu” political speech in a city plaza, stoking the discontent of the Elf-hating majority. Galadriel tells Míriel what she really wants (for Númenor to ally with Elves once more and seek out Sauron), but she crosses a line and ends up in jail along with Halbrand (and the prison’s permanent occupant, that statue of Uinen). Isildur, further inspired by a mysterious voice to be somewhere else, gets himself kicked off the Sea Guard along with two of his friends; not only are they pissed, we learn that Isildur’s brother (Anárion) used to spew “garbage” about the real Númenor over on the western shores of the island and they’re mad at him for that talk, too.
Over in the Southlands, Arondir has a disturbing chat with the “lord-father” of the Orcs, Adar; Arondir is then released on the condition that he deliver Adar’s ultimatum to the refugees from Tirharad. Meanwhile, Theo goes in search of food for his people, armed only with that evil sword-hilt he’s been carrying around; this leads to getting hunted by orcs—who, it turns out, have been searching for the sword-hilt all along. Elrond and Celebrimbor chat while the Elves of Eregion and the Dwarves of Khazad-dûm are working on the new forge-tower (with lovely Elvish scaffolding!). Celebrimbor brings up Elrond’s father, suggesting that Eärendil foresaw his son’s involvement in Celebrimbor’s fate. Elrond then goes back to Khazad-dûm and uses his Sherlock Holmes skills to find what his elusive friend Durin IV is up to. It takes an ominous oath to get the answer: mining mithril, a newly discovered substance. Hmmm. Then, tunnel collapse!
Back in Númenor, Halbrand and Galadriel’s jail-chat concludes with her busting out of her cell and confronting Queen Regent Míriel and her ailing father, Tar-Palantir, in a high tower. Here she traipses past legendary artifacts in the coolest museum on the Sundering Seas and she is led to a palantír, one she’s never touched before. It shows a vision of Númenor’s destruction; only Míriel (and now Galadriel) knows about this possible future. They discuss what can prevent such darkness, but still do not see eye to eye. In the Southlands, Arondir rescues Theo from the orcs and they return to the watchtower. In Khazad-dûm, Disa’s song to the stones of the mountain spares the lives of four mithril miners, and in the aftermath Elrond tells Durin how much he misses his father, which in turn inspires some reconciliation between Durin and his own dad (who hasn’t been so keen on mining for mithril).
In the Southlands, Arondir delivers the message and Theo learns that Waldreg, the village elder, is a wannabe Sauron loyalist. Finally, back in Númenor, the people turn out to see Galadriel off—a single boat will ferry her back to Middle-earth. But a sudden falling of petals from the white tree change Míriel’s mind, so . . . jk, everyone, instead of just sending the Elf away, the Queen Regent will go with her personally, and hey, how about a few other ships and a small army to help liberate the Southlands from Sauron?!
Episode 5, “Partings” — (Hoping that by “partings,” they don’t mean parting with all semblance of Tolkien lore.) The Hartfoots are migrating at last! The Stranger is helping out. Poppy sings a delightful song and we get an Indiana Jones–style map montage as they go. (They totally pass through Emyn Muil, east of Nen Hithoel and the Falls of Rauros. Heading towards future Mordor, it seems?) But following them are three mysterious cultists, who first appear at the Stranger’s landing crater. They are, according to the cast list, the Dweller (has a staff), the Nomad (wears a helm), and the Ascetic (carries a strange shield-like disc), and they sure do give off some sinister vibes. In the Southlands, Bronwyn tries to rally her people to resist when the orcs inevitably come calling, but Waldreg convinces a bunch of them to head out, choosing instead to swear fealty to the bad guys instead. Theo, fortunately, remains with his mom.
On Númenor, preparations are being made for the five ships and 500 soldiers being sent with Míriel and Galadriel. Isildur frets, wanting to go to Middle-earth, but his father, Elendil (who is going as a Sea Guard captain), refuses to pull any strings for his irresponsible son. Isildur’s sister, Eärien, is greatly dismayed by the mini-war that seems to be brewing. She tries to convince her new friend (boyfriend?) Kemen, Pharazôn’s son. Not easily done; Pharazôn is slick and masterful, not merely a dissenter to Míriel’s new direction but a man who sees a disturbing opportunity in helping the “low men” of Middle-earth. The seeds of imperialism are being planted.
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When the Hartfoots are attacked by three wolfish, lion-bodied creatures (not wargs, surely?), the Stranger throws down a bit of magic and repels them. The young men and women of Númenor engage in combat training because this close to the end of the island-kingdom’s power, evidently they’re not a strong military power yet. Galadriel schools some of the recruits, and Isildur’s friend Valandil gets a promotion. Tar-Palantir, up on his feet now, warns his daughter, Míriel, not to go to Middle-earth. There is only darkness there for her. While healing himself with frosty power, the Stranger inadvertently spooks Nori; now she’s not so sure he’s one of the good guys. Over in Lindon, at an elaborate outdoor dinner, High King Gil-galad acts like an asshole, and Durin holds his own (and scores a new table for Disa). Elrond tries to cool things down, but there is clear tension between the Dwarf prince and Elf king. Afterwards, Gil-galad lays it on thick with Elrond and gives him some troubling new exposition about a blight and a diminishing of the Elves. Whaaaa? And mithril is allegedly the result of a battle once fought between an Elf-warrior and a Balrog, and contains light from one of the lost Silmarils, which was allegedly inside a tree at the top of the Misty Mountains?
I say again: Whaaaa?
Isildur and Kemen run into each other in the hold of one of the five Middle-earth-bound ships; the former intends to stow away, the latter to be an arsonist. The resultant explosion (was that Saruman’s black powder in those kegs, or just liquor?!) destroys two ships. Isildur’s heroism in saving Kemen from the fiery wreckage earns him a spot at last. In Lindon, Celebrimbor reveals his part in Gil-galad’s puzzling deception. Elves now suddenly have a need for mithril? Yikes.
On Númenor, Galadriel works to convince a very reluctant Halbrand to join her in sailing back to Middle-earth and to claim his kingship. He speaks of some wrong he’s done that he does not wish to talk about, even as Waldreg in the Southlands and some of the villagers surrender to Adar. Adar demands the spilling of blood to cement this fealty, though we do not see it. But on the plus side, Theo comes clean about the scary vampire sword-hilt he’s got, and Arondir reveals an old sculpture in the watchtower that the Elves have apparently merely covered up. He says it’s possible this sword-hilt is actually a key and may have been used in the enslavement of the Southlanders’ ancestors. He works to pull Bronwyn back from despair, for she fears that surrendering is the only chance for survival. Elrond and Durin talk again, and more of the truth comes out. Elrond shares with his friend the scoop about mithril, which he sure seems to believe. Durin accepts it with some humor. Back on Númenor, Halbrand accepts Galadriel’s invitation and everyone gathers to set sail at last. Only three ships are now pointing their bows to Middle-earth.
Three ships, instead of five. I wonder if that also means 300 people now? And just how many horses can fit onto three ships?
Anyway, that’s that. Now, let’s tackle the big issue. The mithril problem, which—it must be known to anyone new to Tolkien’s world—is absolutely not normally a problem. Mithril is legit, yes, but it’s just a rare and wonderful material worked into metal (so many cool Middle-earth artifacts are made of it, like Bilbo’s mail shirt and the helms of the Guards of the Citadel in Minas Tirith), and it’s even used to make ithilden, “that mirrors only starlight and moonlight,” which is essentially a special ink used on the West-gate of Moria and on Thror’s map of the Lonely Mountain, made to create moon letters.
In The Rings of Power, it’s suggested that mithril may contain light from “the lost Silmaril.” Now, first disclaimer: This is likely a total lie. A conspiracy tightly masked. A plot someone is plotting, whether it’s been concocted by Gil-galad directly or simply fed to him by someone else. Sauron is the obvious candidate there, wherever he is. But let’s proceed as if this claim were true. Even if it isn’t, it’s troublesome that beloved Tolkien characters like Gil-galad, Celebrimbor, and now Elrond all believe it. Hoodwinking Elves shouldn’t be this easy. Then again, these are RoPer Elves, and they’re quite different.
It must be remembered that The Lord of the Rings is the basis for this story, not The Silmarillion or Unfinished Tales or any of the other posthumously published masterpieces that casual viewers might consider mere ephemera. The Lord of the Rings is awesome but it doesn’t tell us much about the Silmarils. Mostly we just get that they were bright and beautiful jewels. They were sought after, stolen, reclaimed, and lost. As I explain in The Silmarillion Primer, much of the time the Silmarils are a kind of MacGuffin; even when they’re not physically present, they’re often discussed, yearned for, invoked, avoided, or even killed over. But though the stories of the First Age include scenes that demonstrate their actual power (usually in the actions of those handling them), there just isn’t much in the material Amazon has rights to. Which means Payne and McKay are forced to make up new things about them. Which will chafe book readers, yeah. Personally, I’d rather the Silmarils not be involved at all. They were a First Age thing. Why drag them into the Second?
In any case, Appendix A tells us that “with the power of the silmaril” Eärendil is able to pass the barriers that would otherwise have prevented his approach to Valinor, allowing him to call on the aid of the Valar to vanquish Morgoth. Then we get this nugget about them:
The silmarilli alone preserved the ancient light of the Two Trees of Valinor before Morgoth poisoned them; but the other two were lost at the end of the First Age.
I was at least was hoping The Rings of Power would stay true to the bit of lore they do have. We’re told the Silmarils alone preserved the ancient light of the Trees, not the Silmarils AND some special substance leaked into the mountain from the roots of a Silmaril-embedded tree. I suppose one could argue that this is something we, the reader, know truly, and that the loremasters of Middle-earth will know only in hindsight. Perhaps it’s feasible that the Elves could be fooled into thinking other things could preserve some of that Silmaril-light. And after all, Galadriel will one day place a bit of Eärendil’s light in her phial. That should be a big deal, shouldn’t it? Why bother with a phial of Eärendil’s light if Frodo’s mithril shirt’s already got some—ummm, let’s call it Silmithril—in it?
And the idea that Elves need this light to avoid perishing, like it’s some kind of inoculation? Ouch.
Anyway, so there are three Silmarils in total, and each imprisons some part of the long-lost light of the Two Trees. One of them, the Silmaril that was pried from Morgoth’s crown by Beren and Lúthien, eventually made its way to their granddaughter, Elwing, and passed from her to her husband, Eärendil. Eärendil now carries it as the Evening Star in his ship, which sails in the heavens for all in the world to see. (Never mind that in Bilbo’s song, Eärendil’s new ship was made of mithril and Elven-glass, and in the First Age, no less!) The other two Silmarils, per The Silmarillion, each end up somewhere unreachable by anyone. One was thrown into a fiery chasm deep within the earth, lost but not destroyed (the Silmarils are made of tougher stuff than even the One Ring), while the other was cast into the Sea by Maglor.
Now, the specific fates of those last two Silmarils are not addressed in The Lord of the Rings, so The Rings of Power can reinvent them. Thus, in episode 5, “Partings,” we’re told that in an obscure legend (the so-called Song of the Roots of Hithaeglir), the lost Silmaril (what, only one is lost?) somehow made its way inside a tree high in the Misty Mountains. And when some noble, pure-hearted Elf and a Balrog once battled one another over this tree, lightning got in on the fun. It “forged of their conflict” a new substance that apparently contains some of that Silmaril-light that was inside the tree.
My first question is: what became of the tree? Are we to believe that particular Silmaril was destroyed in the process, disseminated to become mithril?
And now, for some reason, by spring of the current year (roughly six months away, given all the fall foliage we’ve been seeing), the Elves—all Elves everywhere still on Middle-earth?—need to be “saturated” in this, uhh, Silmithril light somehow or they will all fade into nothing? As Elrond explains to Durin, “Our immortal souls will dwindle into nothing, slowly diminishing, until we are but shadows swept away by the tides of time.” This fundamental change in the metaphysics of the Elves of Arda is probably the most absurd, if it’s true. It probably isn’t. I’m not super worried about that just yet, but it does seem like a drastic and far-fetched method by which Sauron is deceiving the Elves. Just how are all Elves meant to be saturated? Are Rings made of mithril able to somehow project that light upon all Elves in a certain radius? I’d love to see the specs!
So, do Elves diminish in Middle-earth? Yes, that’s canon in and of itself. But not like they’ve described. It’s a complex topic, but the decline of the Elves (and other peoples and creatures, to a lesser extent) is an omnipresent motif in the legendarium. I’ve talked about this before in “Tolkien’s Elves: How the Eldar Half Lives (and Lives, and Lives, and Lives).” But note, The Lord of the Rings itself doesn’t ever properly explain the fading of the Elven race, and since they can’t use The Silmarillion or scads of other books published by Christopher Tolkien after his father’s death, Payne and McKay may just be redefining what that could mean. Maybe. This whole arrangement might just be intended to seem shocking at this stage. To the Elves and to us, the viewers. We’re only on 5 of 50 episodes, though.
My concern is that this sudden desperate need to get so much mithril so fast is how Sauron is going to trick Celebrimbor and other Elven-smiths (if there are even any in The Rings of Power?) into forging all the Rings of Power. It’s a rather weak plot development, if this is so, particularly when compared to Tolkien’s own write-up of the situation (all too brief though it is). And yes, of course it mirrors Halbrand’s advice to Galadriel about identifying what it is your opponent most fears. In this case, there’s been no talk in the show about the Elves fading, so if this is Sauron’s scheme, it’s not something they already fear, it’s something he’s manufacturing for them to fear.
Anyway, so that’s the first bit of nonsense in episode 5, and the most drastic. The second bit is simply this idea that mithril contains Silmaril-light. It’s a bummer because mithril is already awesome all by itself. Mashing together two physical elements in the legendarium seems so unnecessary, and it undermines them both. I would be very curious to know what people unfamiliar with any of Tolkien’s books think of this new idea.
I’m not one to rate episodes or rank them, though. For all this, I rather enjoyed a lot of the scenes in both episodes. But if I had to make a Venn diagram of this show so far, it would be this.
Now for some particulars.
Adar: Definitely a compromised Elf. Still not wild about that idea (since the few Elves who go this route in The Silmarillion are memorable for being few and well-written), but compared to the other plot choices, this now seems a small matter. He sure got riled up when Waldreg mistook him for Sauron, didn’t he? Touched a nerve. Is this a short-lived villain attempting to usurp Sauron, or just carrying out orders as some kind of lieutenant?
Arondir: Still good. Still the most Elf-like character in the show.
Bronwyn: At first I was thinking her role as a leader was too sudden, but she’s just got guts. Who else is stepping up to speak to her people? As Arondir is one of the most believable Elves, Bronwyn feels like a realistic depiction of a mortal woman. Terrified as any of us would be under the circumstance, courageous as a mother, and even willing to consider all options for survival.
Celebrimbor: For all Charles Edwards’ talent as an actor, I’m just not seeing the Elven-smith in him. To pull it off, I feel the show needs to show and not tell. I need to see him in an Elven-smock, with tools of the trade in hand, with smoke and vapors all around. He’s one of the Noldor; he should be industrious, not lounging about with mere props. I suppose it doesn’t help that his one outfit seems to resembles his chamber’s upholstery.
Círdan: Where the hell is he? I’ve heard we won’t see him until season 2. Fine, fine. It’s just weird to hear people talking about Eärendil as though they knew him, when it ought to be coming from Círdan the Shipwright, who was his close friend. Then again, RoPer Círdan could be very different from the faithful shore-dwelling old Elf we know and love from The Silmarillion. RoPer Círdan might act like a Brooklyn cabbie from an ’80s film and chomp on a cigar. (A círgar?)
Dialogue: As in the first three episodes, some of the dialogue is great, and some is just overwrought.
Disa: Even I would try mole-tail stew just because I wouldn’t want to make her sad. She seems such a charming host.
Durin IV: For all the bumpy spots of episode 5, Durin steals most scenes he’s in. He bristles with both emotion and cleverness. I love his trick on RoPer Gil-galad (I’m only sad that RoPer Gil-galad is someone we want to see knocked down a peg), and I love how he sets his feet on solid rock before prompting Elrond to speak the truth. So perfectly Dwarven.
Eärendil & Elwing: I’m grateful we got what we got, because I was half expecting no mention of the greatest mariner of song at all. But now that he does come up from time to time, he feels a bit mischaracterized. I haven’t liked Celebrimbor’s accounts of him. On the one hand, Eärendil was one of the Half-Elven, and effectively mortal until his final choice, and in that way I suppose it makes sense to hear of him more as a man and less as a myth from Elves who’d have known him. But Celebrimbor’s description of him still feels off somehow. “I heard your mother asking him, imploring him, why, why must it be him?” he says. And then I think of the tale, brief as it is in The Silmarillion, of Elwing casting herself into the sea to escape the treacherous sons of Fëanor, transforming into a sea bird by Ulmo, and delivering the Silmaril to her husband on his ship. Even Bilbo’s song in Rivendell, if it sings truthfully, gives her a better role than RoPer Celebrimbor paints.
There flying Elwing came to him,
and flame was in the darkness lit;
more bright than light of diamond
the fire upon her carcanet.
The Silmaril she bound on him
and crowned him with the living light
and dauntless then with burning brow
he turned his prow; and in the night
Eärendil and Elwing became a team, and it’s discouraging to see her downgraded in this way.
Elrond: I continue to appreciate RoPer Elrond, even though he’s been placed in such an awkward position in this story. It’s one thing that Celebrimbor is being played by someone (Sauron or whoever), because in the end the Rings of Power were an act of deception, but I wanted Elrond to be wiser to it all.
Eregion: Finally, we see some more people in Eregion. In the vast distance, just little figures standing around at the base of Celebrimbor’s under-construction tower. But I’m afraid for all its beauty, Eregion still looks so desolate.
Galadriel: Constantly contextualizing her, I’m still okay with RoPer Galadriel’s assertiveness. It’s starting to fit the truncated world of this show, and I’m still confident we’ll see an arc play out properly. That said, I think one of the things that grates on me is this focus on her pain and sorrow. I mean, it fits, yes. But why is she the only Elf who has such loss? She cannot have been the only one to lose nearly all of her family and friends in the wars with Morgoth. It’s the contrast with other Elves that makes her intensity stand out so much.
Gil-galad: I’m feeling bad for book Gil-galad, even though we get so little information about him. RoPer Gil-galad is deceptive, and that doesn’t become him or Tolkien’s world. The good guys might be careful how they word things, and they may hold back and speaks half-truths when necessary, but they so very rarely lie. It doesn’t feel right with the High King of the Noldor, who ought to have been the first one to see Sauron coming. Worse, book Gil-galad is famous for not treating with Sauron at all. Is Sauron already nearby, feeding him lies? And hey, what’s with Gil-galad not rolling the r when he says Galadriel’s name, like a proper Noldorin Elf? Maybe that’s our proof. But no, no, even Sauron would know how to do that right.
Halbrand: I feel nothing strongly about him, only a continual “All right, let’s see where they’re going with this, and why.” I don’t buy for a second that he’s Sauron, as many have guessed (and I guessed myself before seeing the first two episodes). Here’s my primary line of reasoning: In more than one scene between himself and Galadriel, she walks away, leaving him alone with his thoughts, his eyes introspective or even wet with not-quite-shed tears. There is no one looking at him in that moment, no one present to deceive with feigned emotion. Only we the viewers. I cannot imagine any such introspection or sorrow with Sauron. Future Nazgûl or Oathbreaker? Sure, why not? He’s still just a man.
Harfoots: In the landscape shot where we see the Brandyfoots’ wagon on the gray plains (the Braids, per the map), you can see the rest of the caravan camped further ahead. Yes, the Brandyfoots have been relegated to the back of their migration, but the Harfoots are not as cutthroat as many viewers are saying. When Malva says they should have taken their wheels, and you see Sadoc’s face, you can feel how shocking the idea is to simply abandon their own. The Harfoots have a rough life, but it’s not as extreme as all that.
But hey, honest question: Have I overlooked any mention of any other Harfoot communities beyond this one caravan?
Language: Have you noticed there are about thirty different languages you can choose between? Not just subtitles; audio dubbing. It’s amazing. I’ve watched episodes in both Italian and Spanish so my mother-in-law can watch, and even the voice acting seems pretty solid. And, oh man, Poppy’s song. “This Wandering Day” is performed in all of these languages. Some of them are just lovely. I’ve been toggling through them all just to hear the song in different voices and inflections.
Númenor: Two big facts jumped out in me in these last two episodes, consequences of the compressed timeline. Númenor isn’t very skilled in military matters yet (as represented by Galadriel’s street sparring session) and they’ve not gone imperial yet. Given Pharazôn’s opportunism, it’s clear they’ll head that way eventually, but I expect from a 2022 TV show they’re going to keep it rather watered down. In the books, Númenor became conquerors around 1800 of the Second Age, nearly a millennium and a half before Pharazôn’s time. They oppress the people in Middle-earth for a really long time and are second to none in military might; taking tribute and felling the forests of Eriador (to build their ships and fortresses) is what makes that region so empty. So RoPer Númenor is considerably weaker, and from the maps we’ve seen, Eriador is already less forested. In the long run, it seems like Númenor will do far less damage to anyone.
palantír: There is a section in Unfinished Tales that details the palantíri and how they work. And yes, I know The Rings of Power probably couldn’t use that information, so they’ll reinvent the powers of the palantír. Galadriel says, after witnessing “Númenor’s future,” as Míriel calls it, “Palantíri show many visions. Some that will never come to pass.” In this case, the Mirror of Galadriel that she will one day create is, what, a knock-off of this? The Seeing-stones were meant to communicate with one another, and had to be directed, steered. Now, is this particular palantír the Elendil Stone, the one that does work different than the rest, that looks west toward the Sea and the original Seeing-stone on Tol Eressëa? Maybe. It doesn’t matter so much.
But there is one aspect here that bothers me. They have this palantír showing not just some future, the sort of thing that the Valar could also predict. It’s the Númenórean Catastrophe, an event enacted by Ilúvatar himself. In the Akallabêth, when Ar-Pharazôn lands with his armies on the shores of Valinor, the Valar very specifically do not know what to do. They have no intention of fighting back, or attacking Númenor. It wasn’t their call to make. It’s above their pay grade. Manwë himself goes to Ilúvatar for counsel, and the Valar as a whole “lay down their government of Arda.” It is Eru Ilúvatar who does what was not foreseen, what no one saw coming (not even Mandos, the Vala who always seems to know more about what’s coming than anyone). The One sinks Númenor and changes the shape of the world. The idea that this catastrophe would be predicted by, or shown to, anyone feels like such a major lore break in and of itself. If Míriel sees it, and Galadriel sees it, then surely the Valar know about it, too, and now it’s not going to be much of a surprise. At that point, it becomes more of an open secret.
But this is a TV show, not the books, and the stakes do seem lower. I’m most curious now what it’ll be like for a character to carry around this foreknowledge of the drowning.
Pharazôn: Now it’s established that he is, in fact, cousin to Queen Regent Míriel. It remains to be seen whether he usurps the scepter by forced marriage or simply by popular support of his people, but I find that I don’t mind either way. I do find his willingness to adjust his plans with the changing of the tide fitting. Pharazôn seeks to master the current of Númenor, and that is sufficiently creepy. He’s playing the long game.
Schwwwinggg!: Halbrand’s newly forged sword blade makes the ringing sound of metal upon metal when he wipes it with a cloth. Hah!
Southlands, the Sword-hilt, and the Watchtower: So the Elf-occupied watchtower overlooking Tirharad and its environs had me wondering: Do Elves normally keep around evil relics and creepy statues of darker days? I guess RoPer Elves do. For posterity’s sake or the plot’s sake? Allowing vines to grow over the ol’ Sauron-and-sword statue seems to be the equivalent of sweeping dirt under the rug, no? Arondir knows—he’s not simply speculating—that the sword-hilt was a key to enslave the Southlanders, but he doesn’t seem to know if it’s a literal or metaphoric key. Many guess it has to do with igniting Orodruin, aka Mount Doom. Certainly the resultant sky pollution would be the best way to give the orcs some elbow room.
The Stranger: I suppose it’s possible that there’s still something sinister about the Stranger—though I’d say it’s around him, adjacent to him, not of him—but with every episode the idea of him somehow being Sauron becomes more absurd. During the travel montage, and Largo Brandyfoot is telling some story, the Stranger receives a cup with a faint smile, and it sure feels genuine as their “hearth” is shared with him. No one is looking at him there. Just us. He’s no enemy.
“This Wandering Day”: The lyrics are a puzzle, aren’t they? The song comes from Poppy’s mother, sings of “black sand, “eyes of pale fire,” and “the light in the tower.” Are these references to some experience known to Harfoots in the past or Harfoots in the future? Incidentally, per The Lord of the Rings prologue, the Wandering Days will be how hobbits refer to all the times before they settled in the Shire.
Time & Space: The Ring of Power is playing with Stars Wars timeframes, isn’t it? We never see anyone stop to sleep, nor anyone stopping to rest during any of the implied travel. The closest we get to camping and sleeping is with the Harfoots, but that’s their way of life. The fact that the characters seem to jump back and forth between Lindon and Eregion and Khazad-dûm doesn’t bother me half as much as not seeing a single shot of any of them on a horse, or in the company of guards or an escort, especially all these lords and princes. Will Disa’s new table be placed on some kind of Elf-wagon? Some things aren’t important to show, but the lands of Eriador and Rhovanion always seem so empty in the Third Age. Must they seem so in the Second? It would do wonders to show just a couple of travel shots for the Elves and Dwarves, if not montages. Not just because it would make the world seem a little more lived in, but because in Tolkien’s stories, the journey is the story. With the notable exception of the Harfoots, The Rings of Power is feeling like a series of set pieces.
Trees: There are a lot of trees coming up, as befits a Tolkien story. There’re the Two Trees destroyed in the prologue. There’s that tree Arondir was forced to cut down by the command of the orcs in an earlier episode. But I want to bring up two different trees relevant to episodes 4 and 5 above all. So we’ve been told there’s a blight on the Great Tree in Lindon, and Gil-galad admits they first took notice “just prior to Galadriel’s return.” (But he shipped her off anyway, ugh. #NotMyGilGalad) In any case, remember that the sapling in Durin and Disa’s home comes from the same tree, which Elrond described as “the very symbol of our people’s strength and vitality.” But I’m guessing this sapling has no such blight upon it, and I wonder if noticing that will end up being a clue with which Elrond Holmes can unravel the truth? If the tree in Lindon was somehow personally infected, à la Morgoth with the Two Trees of Valinor, then there’s no blight on the Elves at all, and it’s all just a ruse. Lastly, of course, there’s the tree in the Roots of Hithaeglir fable. Surely more of a symbol than a literal tree that once existed.
***
I’ll say again that I’m still enjoying the show. Yeah, I’m shaking my head at it more and more, but I’ve yet to throw up my hands and walk away. It would take a lot to break my ability to compartmentalize fairy tales. I suppose it’s because I still see the best in The Hobbit films, which most of my fellow Tolkien fans still gripe about even as they share images of Martin Freeman and the music of Howard Shore. So much good came from the trilogy, despite its many flaws, and after all these years not one page in my battered copies of The Hobbit has been stained by it.
Just the same, at any time, I can turn to “Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age” in The Silmarillion to remind myself how Tolkien envisioned Sauron’s movements in the middle of the Second Age, and read lines like:
Only to Lindon did he not come, for Gil-galad and Elrond doubted him and his fair-seeming, and though they knew not who in truth he was they would not admit him to that land.
With no mention of mithril or half-baked conspiracies about Elves with a definitive expiration date. And so everything’s fine. No need to panic. I look forward to the next episode, to see if they turn any of these new plot elements to the betterment of the story. Of this story, that is. All the same, it would be nice if they put away the J.J. Abrams mystery boxes by the end of season 1 and just concentrated on telling a good story.
Jeff LaSala is responsible for The Silmarillion Primer, the more recent and much shorter Second Age Primer, the Deep Delvings series, and a few other assorted articles on this site. Tolkien nerdom aside, Jeff wrote a Scribe Award–nominated D&D novel, produced some cyberpunk stories, and works in production for Macmillan and the Tor Publishing Group. He is sometimes on Twitter.
And still no Celeborn? Are we to assume that he and Galadriel are on a Break, like Ross and Rachel in “Friends”?
Or we really not going to have the other half of Middle Earth’s power couple at all?
I think it’s apparent that there’s no Celeborn yet. But I think we will get him eventually in a future season. Probably not Celebrían, though. They won’t want to fastr-track through that much time and kill off so many mortals in the process.
“Even Bilbo’s song in Rivendell, if it sings truthfully, gives her a better role than RoPer Celeborn paints”
You may want to edit that to “RoPer Celebrimbor”.
@3: Updated, thanks!
I’ve been doing my own briefer reviews for myself, my friends and a facebook group on the Rings of Power and we more or less agree. I’ve been hopeful and forgiving of Rings of Power lore, particularly because Tolkien himself only did the broadstrokes, so there are gaps to be filled. I think the Southlands is the best example of this. Obviously (to those of us who know), what happened in the Southlands obviously had to happen. Sauron’s Moving Day. But as far as I know, Tolkien himself never touched it. So seeing that particular blank being filled in is fun and informative. I’m loving Elrond and Durin’s Family. Which I want to pitch as a spin-off. Elrond and the Durins. I’m confused and baffled by the Stranger and it’s our one big disagreement, I still think he might be Sauron or a Blue Wizard. I do NOT want him to be Gandalf. I’m forgiving but not that forgiving. I did have a panic in episode 2 when I thought Durin had a Silmaril and whilst relieved it wasn’t, their Mithril Lore and the Elf Fading just seems to be to be fan-fiction of the worst sort.
I’m still enjoying the show (and my own review also high-lighted Durin’s bluff to get a nice table) and feel it does a lot of things right, I get why they’re condensing the Return of Sauron (around 500SA-1200SAish) and pushing that together with Ar Pharazon’s War. I don’t particularly like it, but I get it. In fact I didn’t quite get when we were (my guess was 1000SAish) until we got to Numenor. My own scores did take a dip at the last episode, in part for it ending in the same place as the previous episode (We sail for Middle-Earth) and in part for the mithril-stuff.
Still, it’s a good show and I’m enjoying more or less the same things you are. I do feel if they want to do some Tolkienesque dialogue, the find someone who’s good at it.
I think it’s possible that the mithril story will turn as some variation on Sauron (as yet unseen) deceives Celebrimbor that they need mithril because of stated reasons, when he actually needs it to complete his plans. Celebrimbor then deceives Gil-Galad by repeating the lie based on an elven story, which doesn’t require that Gil-Galad be deceived by SAURON, just his friend. He then, unknowingly, deceives Elrond who in turn unknowingly deceives Durin.
This is consistent with Tolkien: Celebrimbor WAS deceived and he DID get the others to go along with pieces of Sauron’s plot even in Tolkien. And Feanor was deceived by Morgoth indirectly in the lead up to the revolt of the Noldor for all that Feanor was never directly deceived by Morgoth. There’s precedent.
As for the unrealism of a military coming together so quickly, ok, sure. I’m an ex-Army officer and I can tell you the entertainment industry continually gets the time it takes to prepare or execute military actions wrong. But then so does Tolkien. Leaving aside for a moment the unlikelihood of any given nation remaining dominant for over 2000 years as Numenor did, or 9 ships carrying enough people and provender to establish two HUGE kingdoms within even a hundred years, the Last Alliance laid siege to Barad-Dur for SEVEN YEARS. On the plain of Gorgoroth? Hundreds of miles from the nearest arable land? With what supplies…and keep in mind that if you want to say they shipped it in on horse/ox/donkey drawn carts you then have to explain exactly how the carts carried enough food and water to keep the draft animals alive over that distance while still managing to move a militarily significant amount of cargo.
It’s a constant problem in logistics…the transporting units units consume supplies simply to exist at a rate that renders any technique but frequent supply dumps untenable. And if the siege is porous enough to allow Sauron, and more importantly his orcs, to survive seven years, it is porous enough to allow raiding groups to destroy dumps fatally compromising the siege. As a military man, Tolkien was a first rate Second Lieutenant. His battles show that…as long as we’re talking overlooking things.
@6, I agree that a 7 year siege seems overly long (although Troy was sieged for 10 years, but maybe Homer didn’t think about the logistics much either)
However, I believe that Nurn is arable land. I am fairly certain that after the Fall of Sauron, Aragorn freed its slaves and gave them the land to till as their own. One could infer that Gil-Galad was using those fields to feed his army.
@6 – I have noticed that Celebrimbor always seems to have a story on hand that just exactly happens to fit whatever his purposes are at the moment. One might expect Fëanorian invention at work.
“or 9 ships carrying enough people and provender to establish two HUGE kingdoms within even a hundred years,”
There had long been Numenorean colonists and cites established.
@7 Barad-Dur is further from Nurn than Ithilien by the map. Don’t get me started on the host of Elves and Men mustered in Imladris for three years before setting out, again apparently with out denuding the area surrounding them a days travel in every direction of food.
Tolkien loved big, dramatic sounding things. 7 years of siege. The Captains of the West took counsel for 3 years. Etc.
What I’m saying is, before we insist on any true literary North Star, let’s acknowledge the weaknesses even a preferred text and understand that even he was, shall we say, imperfect.
@9 Of the King’s Men (Black Numenorians) and generally in the wrong place (Umbar, etc.)
Homer did actually think a lot about logistics. His Achæan host raids the coastline for supplies. This turns into a major plot point since that’s where Briseis and Chryseis come from. Naval resupply avoids the problems of feeding draft animals hauling supplies, which may be a partial solution to logistics of the siege of Barad-Dûr: supply via ships coming up the Anduin, supplemented by whatever can be produced in North Ithilien, which can then be hauled overland for the last leg of the journey.
# 11 The Faithful and e.g. Pelargir:
“Thus it came to pass in that time that the Númenóreans first made great settlements upon the west shores of the ancient lands; “
“In all this the Elf-friends had small part. They alone came now ever to the north and the land of Gil-galad, keeping their friendship with the Elves and lending them aid against Sauron; and their haven was Pelargir above the mouths of Anduin the Great.”
Akallabeth
The King’s Men far to the south
“But the King’s Men sailed far away to the south; and the lordships and strongholds that they made have left many rumours in the legends of Men.”
Akallabeth
“2350 Pelargir is built. It becomes the chief haven of the Faithful Númenóreans.”
LotR, App. B
I feel as if the author overlooked one possibility in whay is being planned
the elves need to mithril to make the rings and it is the rings that will save the elves
I do realize this changes the lore with regards to the rings
@11 – Umbar was the Númemórean colony controlled by the King’s Men, but Pelargir was a haven of the Faithful in Middle-Earth. A city nearly a thousand years old at the time of Númemor’s downfall seems like a pretty hefty supplement to nine ship’s worth of refugees.
@14, I didn’t overlook that. Hence:
As we’ve not heard anything beyond “we need vast quantities of mithril by spring” so there’s only so much to be speculated about. Yes, it does seem like this is Sauron’s ploy. Perhaps that he needs mithril for other purposes, or has swindled Gil-galad or Celebrimbor into the idea that the mithril is needed to create the forges that would produce the Rings of Power. Surely “vast quantities” aren’t needed just to make the rings themselves, as it surely doesn’t take much to put into a single ring? In the end there are two “truths.” (1) What Celebrimbor believes is required and (2) what Sauron really wants all that mithril for.
One thing I did forget to ask: Just how is it Gil-galad or even Sauron (if he’s behind it) even knows about mithril at this juncture? Elrond was sent to confirm whether the Dwarves have found the ore yet, not whether it existed.
Hopefully it’s not the Balrog who’s found it first and has sent a message to Sauron. That would be . . . .oof.
I fear I have less amdir than Jeff. So I won’t belabour you all with all my gripes, just share two hypotheses I’ve read that I find likely to be correct. One I like, one I really dislike.
The one I (really, really) like:
The Stranger is the Man in the Moon of Hobbit legend and Tolkien poetry. The poem apparently does mention him falling like a meteor. I prefer this so so much to him being either Olorin or Sauron.
The one I (really, really) dislike:
Adar is Maglor. Note that his armour has decorations that are also present on Gil-galad’s armour/clothing. He also has a heavy glove over one of his hands, the one the Silmaril burnt after he stole it from Eonwe’s tent.
Great review, I’ve had nearly the exact same issues. Another point of contention for me was the fact that Numenor could only send 3 ships? Numenor seems to have been majorly diminished.
PS- A ship was blown up, and basically nothing came from it?
Is it possible that Sauron doesn’t care about the mithril at all
that the goal is to get the dwarves to mine so deeply for it that they release the Balrog
Always enjoy your comments, Jeff, and found myself lol’ing at both of your “Whaaa?” because I had done the same.
Here are 3 possible proofreading concerns you might want to consider:
Galadriel will once day > one day
hear of him as more as a man and less as a myth > delete the first instance of the word as
details the palantír and how they work > palantíri
To be honest, I feel like we don’t really know RoPer Celebrimbor at all — I agree that he doesn’t feel industrious or earnest enough. Honestly, I’d like to see him be more like RoPer Galadriel, fiery and active, more eager to create and less lounge-y. But I suppose the show’s trying to show him only as Elrond sees him and keep its secrets up his green sleeves.
Or maybe I’m still just miffed about him and Elrond strolling up to Moria’s door as if they were crossing the street to the dollar store.
But I’m still loving Arondir’s story and actually think Adar’s an amazing addition so far. Kind of hoping the online theories are true and Adar’s some kind of early proto-orc (possibly tortured by Sauron himself, hence the angry outburst?). Maybe his attempts at making Mordor is to create some twisted version of Cuiviénen in its original/pre-sunlight state (besides so that his orc friends can wear cut-offs)? But then again, I guess this was part of Sauron’s big plan from the start.
I don’t entirely count as somebody “unfamiliar with any of Tolkien’s books”—I’ve read the Hobbit and LOTR once each, twenty years ago, and enjoyed them thoroughly, but haven’t yet made time to reread either. (I read the Silmarillion around the same time. It…did not take.) So I’ll bite on the show’s backstory for mithril, if I may.
It wasn’t my favourite bit of backstory or worldbuilding the show has come up with so far, but I didn’t have the reaction of disbelief/despair/disgust a lot of true Tolkien fans seem to be having. Like, it’s fine. It works. It provides a problem and conflict to drive the story forward. The visuals for the dramatisation of the legend were breathtakingly beautiful, so the first time I watched it I was too busy being enthralled the shiny, shiny silver tree, and forgot to track Elrond’s storytelling. Having rewatched the episode, I still don’t really understand how mithril works in RoP-land, but we also haven’t really been told how Celebrimbor is going to MacGuyver mithril into elven salvation or suchlike, and I’m curious to stick around and find out.
Anyway, just wanted to say thanks, Jeff, I enjoyed reading this, and the comments too.
@17, neither of those possibilities worry me. Man in the Moon can work as an explanation for how they were inspired to write the song. But as an actual Man in the Moon, as in someone like the Maia Tilion, that does seem a big stretch. I don’t really see it going there. And Maglor is too deep a Silmarillion cut, I think he would require too much explanation. Plus it’s hard to imagine the Elf who raised Elrond for a portion of his childhood becoming Adar.
@19, I guess that’s possible, but even LotR lore includes Sauron coveting it. Everyone kind of loves the stuff.
@21, green sleeves! Hah!
@22, you get bonus points just for saying MacGuyver (and for spelling it right).
Portraying the Harfoots as dirty (dirty torn clothes etc.) is a sad “wanderer” trope. They could have done some much better with the Harfoots (and they are Hobbits even though they apparently can’t say that because rights).
@24 Not only are the harfoots cliches of poor wanderers, they have Irish accents, which I hear has not been well received by viewers in Ireland.
While I am familiar with the Hobbit and LOTR books, and even read the Slimarillion once, I deliberately did not refresh my memory before watching the show. I prefer to treat books and movie adaptations as two separate things, which sometimes are even improved by being different. I am enjoying the show so far, and trying not to read too much into things, and match it against what I remember. It has a nice lyrical pace to it, taking time for the plot to get where it is going, which I appreciate. The performances are great across the board, and the costumes and sets are superb. And I love the music. There is far more to enjoy than dislike.
I read the mithril tale as the tree springing up from the lost Silmaril, and its destruction imbuing the veins of silver with the light of the Silmaril.
I don’t agree with your supposition that mithril is bot special and imbued with the light of the Silmaril. I think it’s special because of the light. I also suspect that the mythril veins form a cage that is keeping the Balrog bound beneath the mountain.
It’s certainly way too early for the Wizards to show up, but a defeat here would account for Olorin’s reluctance to go to fight Sauron in the third age. The nomad, the ascetic, the dweller, the stranger. Is this an early iteration of the White Council? Or are they not related, and are these three witches?
My money is on Halbrand, or his heir, being a future Nazgul. They need to introduce 9 kings, and we know even the best of men would eventually succumb. And if the three in whote are in fact witches, there’s another king to be introduced this season.
Adar did not actually deny being Sauron. I don’t think we’ll know for sure who Sauron is until the season finale, probably when he meets with Celebrimbor to begin forging the rings.
I gave up expecting them to stick closely to the lore and just want the show to be good on its own merits. The chief weakness so far continues to be the dialogue when high elves speak to each other.
I agree that the sense of space is inadequate—there is not enough sense of great distances, as shown most absurdly when Galadriel was going to swim back from Valinor. But the very first Jackson movie had that issue in the first half. In the book you know they spend days walking across the Shire. In the movie it is like they move from one set to the next— it really does feel like they are filming inside a theater. When Aragorn led them out of Bree and they camped I was hoping they would show the lightning flashes on the horizon when Gandalf was fighting the Nazgûl— that would have been cool and would have given us the sense of distance, as opposed to something filmed on a theater lot.. That only starts to happen after they leave Rivendell.
@24 They are absolutely Hobbits because “Harfoot” is the name of one of the three Hobbit “breeds” (Tolkien’s word) described in the Prologue of LOTR, along with Stoor and Fallohide. “The Harfoots were browner of skin, smaller, and shorter; and they were beardless and bootless; their hands and feet were neat and nimble; and they preferred highlands and hillsides…The Harfoots had much to do with Dwarves in ancient times, and long lived in the foothills of the mountains. They moved westward early, and roamed over Eriador as far as Weathertop while the others were still in Wilderland. They were the most normal and representative variety of Hobbit, and by far the most numerous. They were the most inclined to settle in one place, and longest preserved their ancestral habit of living in tunnels and holes.” (Prologue Part I “Concerning Hobbits”)
I’ve been puzzled to have seen not one single reference to this in any long article or comment thereto so far, but I can’t pretend my reading of commentary on the series is exhaustive.
In any event, I see no reason the showrunners would be unable to use the term “Hobbit.” They’re just choosing to use this other term from LOTR.
@26, you might be misunderstanding me.
Mithril, in the books, is special but it’s special all by itself. It’s got no link to any Silmaril or Tree light. That’s what I mean.
Now, this RoPer version of it, that’s another matter. They’re obviously making it special in a new way. I’m merely pointing out that it was already awesome, in the books.
That said, if they’re really going with this, with mithril producing its own [presumably Silmaril] light, and it’s not a lie, then that “cage” theory of yours is very compelling. I like that. But now, you’re suggesting the Balrog from the legend is the very one imprisoned, Durin’s Bane? How might he have gone from damaging the tree above the mountain to getting down beneath the trickling-down mithril veins to be ensnared by the same?
The three cultist ladies certainly do have the feel of witches, don’t they?
I agree that Sauron probably won’t be outed until the last episode. But I really don’t see Adar being him. He seems a little bit too petty, and a far cry from the fearsome armored figure in the prologue. He escaped the armies that defeated Morgoth; it’s not like he was defeated by them personally that he’d have been knocked down a bunch of pegs.
I understand they only have the rights to LOTR and the appendices, but is there any logical reason why Amazon couldn’t secure the rights to The Silmarillion? It surely can’t be money, because Amazon have a hoard of treasure greater than Smaug. The Tolkien Estate have always been zealous in guarding the Tolkien legacy, but by not allowing The Silmarillion to be accessed they have basically channelled this muddled Second Age pastiche into existence. I’d argue that’s a lot worse for Tolkien’s legacy than allowing someone to have a decent crack at the Second Age source material.
@29 when Gandalf fought the balrog, they fell from the summit to the depths, though admittedly the dwarves haven’t yet dug their network of shafts for this earlier battle. With a little bit of meta-viewing, I don’t see TV writers putting a balrog there without intending it be the same one.
When King Durin opened the glowing box, I didn’t initially think Silmaril. I thought it might be the Arkenstone.
It occurs to me to wonder if the elves can remove the light from the mithril leaving its physical properties intact. That would be in line with the general diminishment of power from one age to the next.
You may think Adar’s too pretty to be Sauron; I think he’s not pretty enough, but that’s not enough to dismiss the possibility.
I an cautiously optimistic. The first seasons of both this and Wheel of Time are flawed, but show promise, and unlike certain other fantasy adaptations, the ending is already known, so there’s only so far they can stray and still get there.
@1 You are close; it was Elros and Rachel that were on a break
In my head-cannon (excuse me, INTERNAL ADAPTATION) the weird evil sword-hilt will eventually be found to have an inscription that translates roughly as “if found, return to Turin”
@30 As I understand it, Tolkien didn’t want to sell the rights to anyone ever, but in 1968 (5 years before his death) he sold film, stage and merchandising rights for the Hobbit & Lord of the Rings to United Artists when he needed a cash infusion late in his retirement.
Notably, they do include ‘matching rights’ to all other ancillary legendarium materials, but that only kicks in if the Tolkien Estate itself arranges to have it filmed. Which they won’t do, because why would you film something if someone else gets to make all the money off the merchandizing? (20th Century Fox learned that lesson when they let George Lucas keep the merchandizing rights to Star Wars in 1977)
@34 Tolkien’s policy on selling film rights was in so many words “*Art or Cash*. Either very profitable terms indeed; or absolute author’s veto on objectionable features or alterations.”
The price Amazon paid for the rights it purchased was surely cash on a scale Tolkien likely never dreamed. Evidence suggests he would have tolerated a worse adaptation than this one for that. (Though Christopher Tolkien probably wouldn’t have.)
I am a little surprised that Amazon was willing to pay that for what it got, and that the Tolkien estate evidently hopes for still more cash (or possibly better art) for the Silmarillion et al later. But they have many decades before that goes into the public domain (even if copyright isn’t extended again), so who knows?
Having first read Tolkien when the paperbacks came out in the mid-60s I’m kind of a fanboy. At first I objected to the way the story is on TV. When I realized that it’s entirely based on the appendix to LOTR it makes sense. The appendix is a chronicle, not a history or a story. Amazon employed a committee of writers to flesh it out. I know, the writing credit is more limited, but I still smell many meetings. Any time a bare bones plot like the appendix gets turned into something more detailed it acquires new elements. It’s the evil side of the folk process, like a mainstream pop tune based on a Child ballad.
I decided to take it like it is. There are elements I like. The Harfoots are a bit cute but I still like them. The Orcs are fun. Pharazon has some good points. Galadriel is a bit too human for my taste. Isildur doesn’t ring true for me. Some of the dialogue, particular in the Numenorean parts is klunky. Even British actors have trouble making it sound like human speech. (Elven or dwarfish, for that matter.) I realize it’s a long standing convention, but I’m tired of dwarfs having to speak with a Scottish accent.
Regardless, I’m enjoying it. The visual aspect is very good. I love New Zealand. It’s not as good as the Jackson movies or, gasp, “The Hobbit” trilogy, but it’s better than a lot of TV. I plan to keep watching it.
@17 David,
Not to worry. We know who is really being impersonated by Maglor. Galadriel herself has told us:
Legolas Greenleaf, long under tree,
Did your grandpa make jewelry ‘way over the sea?
When you see your dad’s army massed on Long Lake shore,
You’ll do a face palm and say “Duh! He’s Maglor!!!!!!!”
I’m wondering if the mithril story has nothing to do with Sauron but a power struggle between the elves and dwarves. Perhaps the story (which I believe is a lie) gets the dwarves to mine mithril which the elves need for pragmatic (wealth, power) reasons, but also weakens the dwarves. Perhaps the kernel of truth is that Balrogs are attracted to mithril and mining it will lead to the Balrog, weakening the dwarves.
I think they should have framed this as a story being told by mortals in the future. Perhaps switching between dwarven, halfling, and humans as the show goes on. Since mortals do not have the perfect memory of elves, the inconsistencies become more believable. I am annoyed how many elves come off as arrogant donkeys rather than immortal beings of goodness. The only elf I like so far is Arondir. Galadriel acts like a teenager defying her parents, not a being that was born before the war with Morgoth… I’m still going to watch it all regardless.
If nothing else, that song was worth it all it’s own. Absolutely gorgeous.
@39 I’d have gone the other way, and done this as a generational story featuring the Elves. Similar to how House of the Dragon gives us 5 episodes of teenage Princess & Queen, then jumps forward to them as adults, do mini-arcs of 3 to 5 episodes for a generation of men & dwarves, then jump forward to their children and grand-children while keeping the Elven actors the same.
Drive home the differences in longevity.
Another great article Jeff! I enjoyed this very much!
Since you mentioned Finrod and Andreth again, just wanted to thank you for previously mentioning their debate.
And thank you for reminding me of Finrod! Albeit, I was first introduced to him through the Lays of Beleriand. At the time was having a little trouble keeping up with all the “F” names. And I had read part of the Silmarillion.
But when you described him, something clicked!
Yes, yes, yes! The kind elf! Kind and Brave! I do remember him!
So when I discovered the Finrod/Andreth debate and story, it blew my mind! It was like a Tolkien treasure, I never knew existed before!
I also read the straight text of it along with Bilbo’s account. And it is so tempting to go off on a tangent about it! Loved it!
Also have to say parts of Finrod/Andreth debate made me cry (in the best way!) The philosophy is cool and I love the difference between Amdir and Estel…(so needed now.)
And in the midst of the long philosophical discussion, there is both a sweetness and humor. It’s brilliant! Really beautiful!
Thank you so much for highlighting this Tolkien work!
I have many thoughts on it, but better stop while I’m ahead since your article is about RoP. But you said “Estel,” and I just could not help it!
What a joy to know this exists!
Then my next post better be about RoP…I guess! (Laugh)
Does anyoneSo remember there was a LOTR anniversary magazine that came out a year ago, which also mentioned up and coming “RoP.?”
And in the magazine, they used “fake” character names for various actors maybe minus Morfydd Clark as Galadriel.
So we now know “Tyra” is really “Nori Brandyfoot” for example.
There was also a main villain going by the alias “Oren.” So I rechecked my magazine and the actor who was to play “Oren,” was Joseph Mawle. So that’s curious.
In fact they they did not say A main villain but THE Main Villain.
Is it possible Mr. S is Not going to be Season one’s main villain? Or was this intentional mis-direction?
Since Joseph Mawle is Adar now!
Thank you moderator for correcting my other double post! Appreciate it!
So my thoughts on Mithril origin story:
Am hoping it is a deception but also sad to tie this into Gil-galad’s character. (Sigh) Have thoughts about that too. But it would take another major lore change. Especially since “Mr. S” was never in Lindon as previously stated. And I don’t like this theory.,.
But hey, if leaves start withering around you, maybe an elaborate cover story might be prudent? One which can be used for a variety of dark mischiefs?
Kind of doubt this, (want to doubt this) but my mind went there briefly. Why are there veiled serving elves at the table anyway? Felt weird. Some Elf caste thing?
Also Wondering if choosing to not roll rrs is not lack of knowledge, but thinly veiled scorn?
But something tells me just wait. Guess… I just don’t like Gil-Galad being Pompous…when why? Because one “haughty elf” is needed? Or one slick political elf? Ergh! So what about his poem then? Is it to be retrofitted as “political propoganda” peddled by future bards? Because RoPer minstrels always exaggerate? Ergh! I certainly hope not!
I’m also beginning to think that Celeborn might be a key next season to settling some mystery or turning the tides to a new one. That his arrival will clear some dust and fog…like a fresh breeze. I wish ha ha…But who knows? Not Estel for me either!
Then the Other place my mind went with Silmaril Mithril Myth was it is another Easter Egg, even if not intended.
So look at the silver tree (it’s roots a mirror image like um Two Trees in One. (This mirror tree image is also embedded in sand on opening credits.)
Then there is an Elf, A Dark Lord and a Balrog.
And yes a Silmaril and Light. So the Tree is on top of Khazadum (not in Valinor) and it’s just “one tree.”
There is a Dark Lord and a Balrog attacking the tree.
But hey, a Balrog is not technically a Right?
@39 LOTR is framed by Tolkien in just that way–a history written by mortals long after the fact. He presents it as his “translation of the Red Book of Westmarch” which was written by Hobbits. Just how this series is being framed so far eludes me, though. It started out seeming to be from Galadriel’s POV but now it’s expanded to multiple POVs. I never thought that Tolkien intended the elves to be infallible, incorruptible or immune to temptations toward power. They’re certainly capable of violence and war and have been since the very beginning.
Poppy’s song is great, but there are so many levels to that scene! I watched the analysis in the Rings & Realms video and I felt that it missed the forest for the trees. It’s a classic “exile’s lament” and the first stanza, I think, gives us a lot of clues of where the Harfoots may have come from and how they ended up being reluctant nomads seeking a safe home. Many such laments include wistful visions of some faraway place where everything will be wonderful again if only the exiles can get there. But the scene is also a character-builder for Poppy herself, the orphan whose whole family was lost. When Largo asks her to sing, she grimaces–this was her mother’s song and obviously singing it is very painful. But as she goes on, her voice gets stronger, and you can almost feel her slipping into the role that her mother probably played–the clan singer who bolstered everyone else’s courage as they traveled through dangerous lands. The song is beautiful but what it means to Poppy is poignant, and clearly communicated to us.
The whole situation here also hints at something more about The Stranger–If, and I say IF, The Stranger turns out to be Gandalf, we get a feeling of why Gandalf of all the wizards was a constant wanderer, never establishing a “home base” anywhere–the Grey Pilgrim, I believe one of his nicknames is. Just a thought.
Even after “6,” it still niggles me the setup with Galadriel having that Big Brotherly wisdom about dark and light. It continues to feel off to me. Yes can understand this seeks to make a Tolkien-sounding statement. But after Bronwyn’s speech about light and shadow (very close to Sam’s), Galadriel’s just feels odd.
At surface value, I’m guessing that it might be used as a foil to show why Galadriel could have been a Dark Queen. A foil to show why in Lorien years she considered testing wills with Sauron (to show her um temptations.) She passes test and will diminish go to the West. So is RoP Galadriel given character arc to show how all her sorrows and angers also gave her temptation?
It just feels troublesome, that Finrod gives her this dark advice. And almost feels like a misinterpretation of what could have been written. For ex: what happens when one is touched by the shadow or experiences it?
Otherwise, both Galadriel and Finrod with The Oaths to chase Sauron resemble an odd composite Feanor.
RoP Galadriel even said once, that her own people could not recognize her from the enemy. ??? Reminds me more of her uncle, who really did stuff.
I would think in the end, it’s more about what the shadow can do to you…the way the One Ring feeds on anger and Hate…the elements that bring the darkness or put shadow in ones soul.
And I think Galadriel would already have this burden. Well book Galadriel.
But mixed with passion. I guess it’s just more interesting to have her chasing the darkness.
I like the whole RoP elves verses Tolkien. It’s good and helps one to see characters in a different light. RoP Galadriel must have an arc to bring her from point B to point C. And explain that fey look in her eyes. And how she becomes wise Lorien Galadriel. Yes she’s 2000, but I guess audiences need to see her like any strong human character growing along.
And I agree, elves are certainly not infallible. They are complicated. But that does not make them less connected elementally to Arda or take away the mystery. Many will enjoy the Arondir scenes today and even Yvanna was mentioned without name.
Also noticing sort of more realism brought into show today. Maybe there are places where some Tolkien fans wished Tolkien had filled-in the realism and background conversations/experiences more. So now it’s being done here.
There is just a different kind of prosaic set up to RoP overall: elves, other characters, story.
Driving home the difference in time spans for elves and humans almost seems to be purposefully off the table, unless someone references having seen many things.
The RoP elves have started s theory that because elves live long lives, they mature slower mentally.
And I suppose humans with shorter lives and more hardship grow smart faster.
Hard to not take into account experience and observation over 2000 years would at least have some affect on any being? If there was anger think it would have settled differently in Galadriel’s eyes after 2000 years.
The death of her brother shapes her whole arc but he is but flashes of memory to the audience. Sad.
If human’s are writing the story, it makes sense they would portray the elves by their human belief as “Immortal Children.” So that would make sense.
(But that was about the vividness of memory for elves among other attributes. It’s not that they mature more slowly, but it’s part of their inner nature tied to Arda. It’s about the differences between elves and humans even though they are kin in part…Children of Eru.)
And elves aren’t flawed because they don’t mature as fast in the mind as humans. Was Feanor mentally too young to know better? Yep. There you go.
It’s about the choices we make: everyone Human, Hobbit/Harfoot, Elf, Dwarf, Wizard or Ent for that matter.
I think at this point i would prefer more poetry and less biological/mental psychology.
Want to erase Adar post (laugh.) Feel more certain he is just season one villain.
Gil-galad speculation feels like a ramble now.
He is just RoP Gil-galad…I suppose.
Two questions: if someone told a human child that to discern between real light and false light that first the darkness must be touched does anyone think a human child would find that concept so easy? Or so simple?
Second question: Would an elf child immediately find such a concept so easy?
@45
The biggest question I have about an Elf, a Dark Lord, and a Balrog is what happens when they walk into a bar…
@49
maybe they ordered 3 silmar-Lights.
I have to stop reading-into this or that maybe.
Some how keep thinking this or that is an Easter Egg.
Or a code for Feanor. (Like “Feanor was here”)
I am sure Feanor would like to think of himself as a brave Elf, if he was telling the story.
(RoP) Dark Lord and Balrog attack tree
Elf nearby
Silmarillion: Dark Lord and Giant Spider attack two trees.
Elf/ves nearby (Finwe…then Feanor)
RoP: Elf pours light in tree to save it
Silmarillion: Yvanna uses her magic to save light of trees.
Earlier Feanor put light of trees in crafted Silmarils.
RoP Galadriel tells Halbrand that even her own people mistook her for the darkness or evil they were fighting
??? Wonder if Feanor would have said something similar?? Back in the day???
My only question now is what in Middle Earth was going on with Galadriel in # 6 where she seems to embrace the ash of mount doom…as it cascades over her…(is she finally touching darkness to find real Light? Coming to terms with her stubbornness? Elf PTSD? Making a subtle spell to protect the handful of survivors? Did she freeze?
Something told her to keep still? As people are running and dying all around her?! And she sighs when the ash comes like it’s a yoga class? Resigned? Fated?
I guess I’m the only one who thought it was really weird. I’m sure she’ll be back to normal character arc business this coming Friday.
But that embrace the Ash scene made me Huhhhhh? Whaaaa? Really? After you came all the way to help???
Also wonder if they will ret-con Halbrand story…if he is the Big Dude…so that the reason Galadriel never trusted Sauron is because Sauron as Halbrand already betrayed her…so she somehow recognizes his energy in the next form…even if she was fooled at first. I don’t like that either…but maybe it’s once you’ve been played by Sauron you never forget.
By that logic Sauron could have been in Lindon.
Cause yes there was no one named Sauron in Lindon but that does not mean he could not be there.
So Galadriel was not fooled by Sauron but might be fooled by Halbrand. So maybe he put a spell on her. It would explain the yogic breathing at Mt. Doom class while people are running and dying all around. Or maybe she found the one level piece of ground that wouldn’t sink. Nothing she can do right??? Wait out the storm?
Concerning the multi-language dubbing, for some reason the Arabic and European Portuguese dubs retain “This Wandering Day” in English rather than translating it into their respective languages. The Arabic, Japanese and European Portuguese dubs all leave the Númenórean patriotic song, “What was the land immortal hands”, in English. (Also, the Polish dub is in a different format from all the others, which I believe is the norm for Polish dubs of foreign content: rather than a full voice cast dubbing the characters, a single male narrator reads all the dialogue in Polish, with the original English dialogue still audible under his voice, although muted. However, the Polish dub handles the two songs correctly within its own format, i.e., the narrator speaks the lyrics in Polish while the English singing remains audible underneath.)
I believe there was reportedly a rights issue with the series using the word “Hobbits”, but in any case, Hobbits as such don’t exist yet at this point in Middle-earth’s history. The Harfoots are one of three ethnic groups from which the Third Age Hobbits will be descended, and the word “Hobbit” itself isn’t coined until much later.
Ugh, thank you for mentioning one of the storytelling conceits that rubs me the wrong way: the mystery box! For me, one of the issues I’m having with the general plotting/pacing is that it’s clear they are trying to build suspense or some type of mystery to keep us guessing…but I find that it just serves to draw things out, force characters to hold the idiot ball and just be generally convoluted. I’m not sure that the presence/identity of Sauron really needs to be a mystery to the viewer as long as it’s a mystery to the Elves.
Anyway, your Amdir/Estel analogy is right on :)
By now we’re already another episode in, but I share your general reaction to the way the nature of the Elves’ spirit, diminishing and ties to Arda are being depicted here, along with the whole mithril origin/magical cure. (Honestly, I kind of prefer mithril just be something special on its own, and in a way it also cheapens the Silmarils to make them present in something other than Eaerandil’s star. I also don’t like that it adds an extra motive to the delving too deeply aside from just normal greed.)
And yeah, the other option is that Sauron is already lying, but I don’t love that Gil-galad is so easily duped (doubly so if Halbrand is really Sauron and Galadriel is just falling hook line and sinker for him).
I also think I’m the only person for whom the Elrond/Durin relationship does not work, because Elrond has been so slimy and shifty. He did Galadriel wrong, and then he did Durin wrong, but still manages to talk/charm his way out of anything. I appreciate that he eventually came clean and felt kinda bad about it, but he just isn’t trustworthy in my opinion.
ALSO YES THANK YOU FOR SPEAKING UP FOR ELWING! I was cringing so hard at Celebrimbor’s description of her, especially because that image of her as the gull rose stained by the settings un is one of my favorites.
I don’t see RoPer Elrond as slimy in the least or even deceptive. He does carry the burden of another’s agenda with him, but it’s clear his friendship is genuine. Even with Galadriel, he may have tread carefully, but he seems to have really been happy that she could go to Valinor (despite the sketchy conditions involved in this adaptation), even though he can see she doesn’t want to. It’s Gil-galad and Celebrimbor who are coming off as slimier.
Regarding Elwing, yeah, it just hurts a little bit seeing a female character in Tolkien, who are few enough as it is, denied her moment.
“Elwing Bearing the Silmaril” by Peter Xavier Price, whose work I included a few times in my Silmarillion Primer.
@54 nope nope nope – that bit where he used his Elven hearing and lipreading skills to spy on a conversation that had repeatedly been told was none of his business was a really gross violation of trust to me (and in real life would be enough for me to write somebody out of my life completely). He then, when caught, flat out lied about his motives for being there (he did NOT visit the dwarfs because of ‘friendship’ or because ‘it had been too long’ but because he wanted something. If Celebrimbor’s project hadn’t come up, he would have stayed away another 20 years).
Somebody else pointed out he was the one who wrote the speech Gil-galad used to sideline Galadriel and clearly it was sprung on her at the last minute but he gave her no indication it was coming.
I’ve had some nasty experiences with being betrayed/manipulated/used by false friends and Elrond passes the sniff test for that. RoPer Elrond is a wannabe politician who can’t be trusted (even if he also is being manipulated) to be straightforward. I suppose at best you can say he lacks the fortitude to actually be a decent person even if he feels real bad about it, boo hoo.
(If you couldn’t tell I REALLY dislike the RoPer Lindon Elves…. :) )
ETA: I should point out there are plenty of things I am loving about the show, namely the Harfoots, Khazad-Dum, Arondir and most of the stuff in the Southlands. And the music :) The Numenor stuff has been midddling to me in part because I am just not sure yet what they are doing with the tlmelines (like…is this how Isildur and Elendil end up in Middle Earth now? But presumably they are going to bring Sauron back so he can corrupt Pharazon. Is Anarion going to play a part? What is Earien’s role in all this…?). But it IS interesting to see more of Miriel and I’m wondering what her eventual fate will be…at least she has a little more agency here, and I liked the part where she and Bronwyn had their little moment. It was nice to see two non-catty, powerful women lifting each other up, so to speak.
Lisemarie, well, I cannot address your particular sensitivity to the topic of betrayal (only to say I can relate). But each case of Elrond’s action seems to have layers to it. His investigating (the lip-reading and all that) seemed to be his response to realizing that Disa was lying to him. It was reactionary. Note that he tried to be direct first (asking about Durin’s whereabouts, etc.), but the Dwarves weren’t being direct with him.
Just a lot of ulterior motives going on, to be sure. Which doesn’t feel like Tolkien’s Elves. I’m only arguing that Elrond may have a few reasons going on, but that his friendship is still his priority. Not his king’s. His.
I’m really enjoying your breakdowns, and I LOVE the tip on listening to the songs in the different languages available.
BUT.
“Hoodwinking Elves shouldn’t be this easy. Then again, these are RoPer Elves, and they’re quite different.”
My brain stopped reading, took those two sentences and ran with it. HA!
“RoPer” suddenly became Roper, as in Mr. Roper, and THEN, I had a brief, but joyfully chaotic, moment in my head with the cast of Three’s Company in a production of Rings of Power.
And just….yes. Thank you for that unintentional brain-trigger, that was a VERY entertaining ADHD sidebar my brain made. Especially the montage of shenanigans I imagined playing during the “come and knock on our door” theme song.
Would Chrissy be Galadriel? Don Knotts would kill it as a RoPer Elf. Joh Ritter….where would his antics fit best?
@56 – yup – lots of ulterior motives.
I would argue that Elrond had no right to expect the Dwarves to be honest with him about sensitive matters of state like this (especially given that he WAS there with ulterior motives), so I feel he violated a boundary. Disa lied to him because he was constantly pushing past a boundary that had been set, so I find her actions much less objectionable. She tried being direct, but he kept pressing, and so she had to come up with something.
But I agree this kind of deceptive statecraft is not really what I think of when I think ‘Tolkien Elves’. Ugh.
@57, Mr. Roper, hah, I hear you. I came very close to pointing out that RoPer shouldn’t be confused with the tendril-flailing underground D&D monster of the same name!
I do love that Tar Miriel’s foretelling of the Akallabeth (beyond the abilities of the Valar) disturbs you, but there is one countercurrent in the legendarium that which makes me a little happier with it. The Valar’s knowledge (even Námo and Manwë’s) is limited mostly to pre-Ëa instruction from the Big Boss: largely the music of the Ainur which seems to cover the physical stuff of the universe, weather, plants, and animals of the universe, but less so the Eruhini.
Even the Quendi are bound by the Music: it is Men alone who can shape the chances of the world “beyond the Music”, but still, like Melkor, have their utmost origin in Eru. This implies that human beings have some sort of unique direct (if fuzzy) line to Eru: the most famous example is the Tale of Andareth’s Voice, but less remarked and in the proper historical record is the words of Hurin before Morgoth, where it really does seem to me that Eru speaks to Melkor directly via Húrin: “It comes not from the lore of the Eldar, but is put into my heart this hour.” To me that sounds an awful lot like the Big Boss is coming down for a quick second and (subtly) reminding Melkor who’s in charge.
So it doesn’t necessarily boggle me that Miriel, as the greatest of the Men of her day, might get some sort of advanced notice of possibilities that not even Namo could see. The unique free will of humans (part and parcel of the Gift of Ilúvatar to Men), and the fact these visions are not yet fully predestined future, would even account for how you can have failed prophecies like how Turin will kill Angalacon the Black, or how Hurin’s words are themselves conditional “even *should* Menel and Arda fall to your dominion…” Dooms from Mandos don’t seem to have that same kind of conditionality (“tears unnumbered ye *shall* shed”; “fates of Arda, earth, sea, and air, *lay* locked within them”), whereas maybe direct-from-Eru prophecies (or Prophecies of Men) have more respect for the freedom of Men that comes directly from the source. They also (Hurin aside) seem to generally come to women, which would make sense why in all the centuries of Númenor Miriel is the first to get this signal.
The only remaining problem here is why then should Galadriel be able to see these visions too? Ilúvatar (Akallabêth and Ëa aside) seems to love nothing more than a ripple effect (a ring accidentally slipping off Isildur’s finger, Gollum coincidentally tripping, arrows happening to not touch Beren, the second of which at least, right there in the Cracks of Doom, is almost certainly beyond the influence of Manwë as the geographic concentration of Mairon’s power, just like Manwë couldn’t peer into the depths of Utumno, nevermind effect what goes on there). Once Miriel sees it, maybe that enables Galadriel to see it. But since the Valar don’t really understand any of the Eruhini, since they didn’t create them (Aulë somewhat excepted), even if many Eruhini may have some vague idea about possible futures beyond the definitiveness that seems characteristic of Valar futurecasting, maybe that conditionality (or remaining free will) limits the Valar’s comprehension of these visions. This could also explain, since Eru’s preview of Ëa to the Ainur cuts out sometime around the Dominion of Men, why prophecies of Men concerning the Dragor Dragorath/the Second Music, seem to be richer than “official”, deterministic, Mandos-approved prophecies, and certainly richer than the Eldar’s complete lack of stories. For a race so tied to Arda, such concepts are probably too scary to seriously contemplate (much like how we on the mortality side of the coin fear death).
Even if you don’t buy my crackpot Eru prophecy theory, it does seem at least the Drúedain had some sort of advanced notice that the island of Elenna itself would fall, as they told Tar-Aldarion way back in the day, “The Great Isle no longer feels sure under our feet, and we wish to return to the lands whence we came.” It could be a metaphysical extension if they weren’t sure Númenor would remain good, but given their fear of the Sea and attachment to land (and it seems their direct manner of speech), I’m personally inclined to believe they meant it at least partially literally. They thought, or maybe even foresaw, whether through the Grace of Eru or otherwise, that there was a possibility that Elenna would fall into the Sea.
Oh boy. Looking forward to your response on 6 and 7. Will not go into it here but these incoming Easter Eggs whew! Sorry if I slipped up and gave too much away in a previous posting. Or came off edgy…long day laugh. I have way too many posts under Jeff’s article here!
Is it just me or does Galadriel seem to have a dark cloud and bad luck that keeps following her around wherever she goes? Yes some will call it “Halbrand,” yet there was a literal storm near Valinor too. But maybe he was nearby.
Re: Elrond…I understand your take Lisa Marie. I know others like him and I want to as well, but for me there is a feeling of inconsistency in his dialogue. For example this young Elrond brags in a way very inconsistent from the character I have in my mind.
Not talking about good natured elf/dwarf ribbing similar to Legolas and Gimli. But sort of over the top stuff…but I get ahead of myself. The point is when there are in-depth interactions between Durin and Elrond I’m more than a little distracted by the inconsistencies. It takes away the suspension of disbelief. Durin is great though!
Maybe not everyone shares the same opinions about Hugo Weaving being right for the Elrond as “kind as summer,” but I enjoyed his warm bemused smile when Sam and friends busted the meeting. Also when he said “I was there 2000 years ago,” they used the same actor for the back flash and I think it fit…and emphasized the long live of elves compared to Men. It had gravitas and mystery. It felt right.
Now when Roper elves. Yeah I kept thinking of ropes too just can’t get that out of my head! It’s perfect! So when Roper elves are portrayed instead of this feeling of Ohh those same beings were there then! You are given something different.
There is more of a feeling of ohhh look at what they were like when they were younger (very younger.) ”that’s so cool!”
Almost like the elves are pointy eared puppy dogs and kitty cats. Ok I exaggerate laugh…
cause then there are the older Roper elves too.
To do it the other way wouldn’t require the same LOTR actors but actors who looked close to them and elf hair style similar to that. But that wasn’t the plan. (Couldn’t get to close to Peter Jackson vibes) minus the similar lines ironically.
I think it’s hard for a lot of people because it feels like a re-invent of Tolkien LOTR history. Just like the weird Mithril legend. It could almost feel as though the writers are saying: “wouldn’t it have been much cooler if Tolkien made the elves more like us? They are immortal but eventually sooner or later they get their lines and gray hair. Aren’t they more believable as a flawed people if they look more like us? Wouldn’t it be scientifically more believable if elves matured slower than we do mentally because of their longevity? Elves are kind of out of touch with humanity. Tolkien’s elves are cool and we will have a handful of nice looking young ones, but wouldn’t it be nice if we changed that trope of the beautiful elves? Tolkien was from a different time…this is 21st century. Wouldn’t the elves feel less two dimensional if they looked more like us and had to go through growing arcs just like any human character?”
The writers might not intend this AT ALL but the way other reviewers outside of TOR ;-) praise these changes using some examples from above it would not be hard to believe alas! (Random reviewer: it’s nice to see elves portrayed as just another flawed people rather than mysterious beings.” These kind of reviewers are celebrating all the changes made.
Roper elves are so relatable and real. I think it’s not fair to the show writers when critics do this but It is what it is.
Again I will say yes elves are flawed because they are complicated just as humans are flawed because we are complicated. But the elves flaws are not based on slower mental development. Refuse to make excuses for Feanor. It’s All about the choices We All Make no matter what kind of being we are immortal or not. We all have flaws.
Durin Thank God Illuvatar truly feels like a real dwarf! The writers captured him perfectly! Love him! He’s one of my faves. But have to agree with another poster elsewhere, a lot of other characters are exhibiting inconsistent dialogue and behavior. It’s very odd. And a little unsettling…
One could almost believe Sauron is influencing a number of people/characters already or is somehow in their heads. Don’t like that. But I do not know.
For me I have trouble of thinking of Tolkien’s works like an iPhone, which will constantly need upgrading to work or be enjoyable. (To clarify this has nothing to do with the Roper cast—-there have been highlights in the show like Disa’s song and Arondir and the tree/seeds and all.)
But it’s the other stuff .
There is also this idea going around from I’m guessing millennials and younger (OF All and every background) that until ROP 90% of the world didn’t know about Tolkien or LOTR until ROP. Whaaa?
What about 1960s and 70s and Frodo lives shirts?
Or Tolkien fans from Japan and other places all around the world prior to ROP or even LOTR movies?
Again it is what it is.
But for now Peace to All.
Hah, thank you for mentioning me, because this episode did NOTHING to endear Elrond to me. I still find Durin to be trapped in an abusive, manipulative friendship. Elrond has not given ANYTHING in this friendship. Durin is just too good for this sinful (Middle) earth.
I also cannot tell you how much I HATE the “reveal” that Elrond “let” Durin win. I call total bullshit on that. And even if it’s true (and I will hate it if it is true because just let the Dwarves excel at SOMETHING, you know?) Elrond lets it out in the most slimy, manipulative way possible. He didn’t HAVE to reveal it, but he totally chose the moment Durin was at his most emotionally vulnerable because he knew, in the end, he would get what he wanted from him. UGH I hate him so much. Every single gesture of “friendship” is calculated and manipulatiive.
I don’t even disagree with Durin that it is not worth risking dwarven lives (which he has a responsibility to protect – more of an obligation to them than he does tot he Elves) to risk. Of course there could have been some compromise – we’ll mine until it is unsafe, and nobody will be compelled to mine if they don’t want to – but he’s not wrong at all. (Nevermind I hate the metaphysics they are introducing here anyway…)
On the more positive side I enjoyed the Harfoots (although I really have no idea what the 3 witches are or even how they might fall into the legendarium) and some of Galadriel’s talks here really hit on what for me are prime Tolkien ideas.
But I totally agree that both this and to some extent Wheel of Time, are being approached with the assumption that the original author’s works need improving, not just adapting.
@60/61 – very cool thoughts! I had totally forgotten that part about the Druedain.
@60/61 – very cool thoughts! I had totally forgotten that part about the Druedain.
Yes Lisa Marie, I was thinking of you as I watched the next. Can see why this frustrates you…for sure! Know what you mean!
Then the Big Brag? That was weird in a different way. Even if one was being politically sly, I’m not sure they would brag like a “2nd grader…”
And if they were being forthright, they wouldn’t either.
It just completely dispels the illusion he will grow into Elrond.
But that’s just my opinion…heh
On an interesting side note about growing arcs and character arcs for anyone who knows children or adults who once were kids, there is sometimes a bit of the adult the child will become in the child.
And a bit of the ways of the child in the adult.
Not talking about childish, but maybe more along the line of passions and interests.
Some of the best movies and biographical ones will show that: love of music, art, philosophy, science, poetry, mechanics etc. Or other characteristics, which could range from joyous to studious, passionate, stubborn, tenacious or all of that combined. and that’s what is tempered and honed through the journey of life the rocky roads, storms and fires and beauties sorrows and joys along the way.
The spark already lives in the child.
I definitely understand the growing arc, going through experiences changes, challenges and conflicts, that can shape character.
But to me, that other spark brings a beautiful continuity full circle.
So that’s why I’m not as sure about someone needing to be completely different in one age than another to show a growing arc. Unless there is major trauma/loss or Sauron influence and corruption.
This is also the reason child/teen/young adult actors are chosen who very closely resemble the main adult actor in other shows. Some shows now will even use a younger relative of actor/actress to do this!
Of course how much Roper actors resemble the older characters or idea versions of LOTR characters will be up to debate and various opinions. He/she is just like! Or nope not at all!
But again just my opinion. And I take in mind there are also tragic tales alas!
I know Sylas’s essay is up for 7. And Jeff probably will cover 6 and 7 just before 8 arrives!
It’s hard to wait though laugh. Have too many thoughts.
And rambled a bit wildly and edgily. Thus, my first post under other essay never went up, but that’s okay I was tired that night anyway! Chuckle.
I do agree with you Lisa Marie, that other parts of the much needed one-on-one between Galadriel and the boy did ring very much of Tolkien, besides my Whaaa? On the other part.
But I finally expressed myself less edgily with my next post below Sylas’s nice essay on 7 (Sheepish Grin)
The odd bit about Elrond discrepancies is that others are seeing discrepancies in other characters as well now, which is a bit confusing. More than one person has mentioned this.
And maybe the actors don’t feel that way at all. Or the writers…Who knows? Shows can be that way sometimes.
Well at least Jeff and all of us agree Gil-Galad is being weird!!! Such a shame!
Hey, what if this is all a dream? Or a vision one character had? Whew!
It is just hard for me to pretend that some strange line or weird quirk never happened when characters go back to back and forth banter. Because I keep re-playing it in my head.
I even reeled from Galadriel’s Elvish PTSD freeze in front of mount doom. In spite of her deemed failures thought of all times, now was the time to see the Captain of the Northern Armies in true action. Unless she was on the only solid ground??
Tar-miriel meanwhile was completely acting both Queen and Captain to her people at her own personal sacrifice.
But I’m supposed to have these thoughts next week? Laugh. Jeff’s 6-7 take??
No matter. It is lovely to see how many people love and care deeply about Tolkien’s stories and Middle Earth, which has claimed its own reality in all of our imaginations!!
Have to take it all in Strider I suppose. Yes I did go there. ;-) Heehee.